As Nepal is heading toward democratic transition, religious fundamentalists and royalists are trying to destabilize the country under the cover of defending Hinduism. These are the people who were kicked out of the power by April’s popular Peoples’ Movement. They were desperately looking for an opportunity to fight back. They found one in the parliament’s historic proclamation that declared Nepal, the world’s only Hindu kingdom, a secular state.

The anarchic mobs of Hindu fundamentalists are not only burning copies of newspaper that wrote in favor of secularism but also trying to exploit the public sentiment in cases like mistreating of a patient by a hospital. The other day, extremists burnt the copies of Kantipur daily with an editorial welcoming the secularism. It is widely believed that extremists were instigating the protest against Kathmandu’s Everest Nursing Home yesterday and the day before yesterday.
we have to stabalize this rise og huduism fundamentalism , or else GOD save us.

source: http://www.blog.com.np/united-we-blog/2006/05/26/neutralize-hindu-fundamentalism-in-nepal/

agree with parliament's decision to declare Nepal a secular state? (Read 151 times)

Re: Do you agree with parliament's decision to declare Nepal a secular state?
« Reply #15 on: May 26, 2006, 09:35:41 pm »


In ancient times, Muslim armies attacked Hindus in India causing many to move east into Nepal. Slowly they came into contact with native tribes (most of Mongolian descent) of modern Nepal.
Extracted from an Indian book.

I suggest Mr jai Nepal you are one of the few disillusioned ones to believe that Hinduism originated in nepal itself??

Yes We should appreciate the peaceful and hormonial nature of the nepalese --that they have started to adapt themselves to hindu culture -though there are often anger expressed in communities like Newar or Gurung( for having their own culture supressed and having introduced caste heirarchy on thier own community -ever since they started inclining twds hinduism)

A good suggestion for you to read is a book by Dhor bahadur Bista.
You will get the reflection on how hinduism started in Nepal and how history has been biased to the original rulers of nepal-the natives(Janjatis)




Re: Do you agree with parliament's decision to declare Nepal a secular state?
« Reply #16 on: May 26, 2006, 09:47:30 pm »

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I am not worried about how Hinduism started in nepal and where did it migrate from. From the moment I was born and till I die I am a Hindu. I am not a hardliner, nor religious either but I strongly beleive that Nepal should remain a Hindu nation. It has given us a reason to remain United and fight against other faiths who try to disintegrate us. I simply feel proud to be called Nepali and Hindu, and they go side by side for me ( I think not just me, everyone - even for muna). I simply can't understand, how politicians think nepal can be a better place by calling it a secular state. Do we want to be like western countries, where they no relegion and faith. Hinduism is not simply a relegion to me but it is my faith, a sense of wisdom and a proud history. Even jai nepal has mentioned Hinduism to have rooted deep down in the history. Why should we loose our deep root, simply because these politicians want a big piece of Pie. I agree with your problem of caste system. Yeah we can bring new laws for it or strengthen the existing one. The source of ur problem is not relegion it is racism, castism and sexism. I think we should stick to nepal as Hindu country but overcome the cast, race and sex discrimation side of thing.

The answer to the question is - NO I DON'T AGREE AND I WILL NEVER AGREE.

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Muna
Newbie

Posts: 8


Re: Do you agree with parliament's decision to declare Nepal a secular state?
« Reply #17 on: Today at 02:05:05 am »

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PEOPLE HAVE REALIZED THE NEED FOR SECULARISING A DEMOCRATIC COUNTRY AGAINST ONE TAG IMPOSED ON IT.
IT IS HIGH TIME ..WE SHOULD BE LESS PROUD OF BEING CALLED A KINGDOM(DOESNT EXIST IN TODAY'S WORLD ,ONLY EXISTED DURING THE SLAVERY AGE) OR LESS PROUD OF BEING CALLED THE ONLY HINDU COUNTRY BUT MORE SHAMEFUL TO BE CALLED THE MOST POVERY STRUCK COUNTRY.

EVEB THE PURE HINDUS ( BRAHMINS-....E,G. SO CALLED DR. BABURAM) HAVE REALIZED THAT.THE BRAHMINS ARE OFTEN BLAMED .... IN FACT FACES THE WORST VOCAL DISCRIMINATION ....BEING CALLED SHREWD, CHEAT, TAPARA...BAHUN BAJE ( THOUGH THEY MAY NO LONGER PERFORM THEIR ANCESTRAL HINDU OCCUPATIONS...WHO INFACT ARE POWERFUL LEADERS TODAY). WHY ARE THEY OFTEN EXPRESSED HATRED EVEN THOUGH INFACT THERE ARE POOREST OF POOREST BRAHMIN-CHETTRIS IN NEPAL .

WHAT IS THE REASON FOR THESE HATRED ...

WHY IS THE COUNTRY SO POOR ??

WHY ARE THE PEOPLE SO IGNORANT??

WHY CANT NEPALESE STILL MAKE DIFFERENCES BETWEEN ANIMALS AND MEN??

WHY ARE THE EXTREMIST SO WORRIED ABOUT A COW BEING BUTCHERED BUT LESS BOTHERED TO FIND THE ROOT CAUSE FOR THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE BEING KILLED?

HOW CAN THEY BE FOOLED....BELIEVING A NORMAL PERSON TO BE BISHNU'S INCARNATION INFACT THE IGNORANT HINDUS STILL BELIEVE THAT IN THE VILLAGES??? WHY DONT THEY REALISE THAT WAS A SETUP ...A POTICAL PLOY ...ESP AT THE ERA WHEN PEOPLE WERE BLIND AND IGNORANT??


WHY CANT WE ACCEPT CIVILISATION OR GLOBALISATION IF IT 'S HEALTHY FOR ALL THE NATION??

NOW THAT THE COUNTRY HAS BEEN DECLARED SECULAR...I AM SURE THEIR WOULD BE LESS SUPPORT FOR MAOISTS...WHO ALSO GAINED POPULARITY AMONG COMMUNITIES WHO ALWAYS FELT UNCOMFORTABLE WITH THE TERM HINDU NATION BEING IMPOSED





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Bayan
Newbie

Posts: 39


Re: Do you agree with parliament's decision to declare Nepal a secular state?
« Reply #18 on: Today at 05:58:42 am »

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I agree with that Muna reads a lot and she really has great knowledge. But I can not agree with her thoughts with respect to this topic of discussion. You have to experience a real life among muslim people, especially from the middle east to feel how they relate to you as a Hindu. During my study in Ukraine, I had many muslim institute-mates and class-mates from the middle east (Siriya, Palestine, Oman, Yaman, Lebnon, Sudan, Somaliya, Iraq, Iran, Egypt). I was only one nepali in the city and at the university. But their number was more than 40. When one of them needed help in doing assignments, projects and even in exams they came to me with request, and I had always helped. But at other times they behaved with me like no better than dust on their feet.
So, based on my experience, I think within 10 years you will have to fear to tell that you are a Hindu, if this is not reverted.

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NepaliBabu
Newbie

Posts: 1


Re: Do you agree with parliament's decision to declare Nepal a secular state?
« Reply #19 on: Today at 02:43:49 pm »

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Yes I do agree . This is what the need of present world. There should not be politics in religoin , race , colour and the topic of humanity.And the natoin is in the edge of change Our leaders should not trable to go with the need and wind of change around the world. This era wants the secular world not even a state. Every leader should think globally not in the contrary of Country. If any organizatoin or party does politics in religin they will get the big slap ppl as BJP got in India. Still there is a big racial problem in Nepal as Gvt and other too are announcing the quota for Dalit , mahila , janajati bla bla ... i dont feel this is the way of secular. If every ppl need right than just go democratically. Every ppl should achive with their skills and educatoin.

Announcement of secular state disappoints Hindus all over the world
Kathmandu, 26 May: India’s major Hindu nationalist political parties such as BJP, RSS, Bajrang party, Shivasena along with some major Hindu organizations seem quiet with the Nepal’s parliamentary announcement which declared Nepal as a secular state, writes Hindu weekly.

The declaration has disappointed the Hindus all over the world as the honor of calling Nepal as the only Hindu nation in the world has been snatched.

The following declaration is a conspiracy to establish Nepal as the Christian headquarters of Southeast Asia and it would turn out to be very dire for the Indians in the coming days.

People’s News/KDB

Kalp writes (posts):

((The declaration has disappointed the Hindus all over the world as the honor of calling Nepal as the only Hindu nation in the world has been snatched. ))

What's honor to one person is dishonor to the other person. Secularism is the 'middle path.' It doesn't disgrace Hinduism - but puts it on equal footing with other religions of the land.

If what Kalp posts is to be believed, it seems to me the only reason the Hindus want Nepal to be a "Hindu state" is so that they can brag to their foreign friends, " You know, Nepal is the only Hindu country in the world." It's all about the bragging right, isn't it?

What a shallow/stupid reasoning! And Kalp ascribes this to be the position of the Hindus all over the world.

Kalp certainly insults the intelligence of the Hindus all over the world. He probably thinks the Hindus all over the world are morons!

Karmapajee,

Kalpjee has quoted the news source above. So please read it carefully before critisizing someone. Do not insult your intelligence by writing things just for the sake of secularism. HINDUISM IS NOT SOMETHING WE HINDUS HAVE TO BRAG ABOUT !!!!!

I hope your understanding expands a bit when I say it. Otherwise please read about Hinduism before commenting on anything. When a state or govt. brings any drastic change - it has to be in a democratic way. Nepal is a country where more than 85% of the people are Hindus and majority certainly want it to remain a Hindu country. A govt. that does not have the mandate of the people DOES NOT HAVE THE AUTHORITY TO CHANGE THE SPIRIT OF THE NATION !

still kalp deserves a whammy. he probably posted that news blurb because he believes in it himself. so no harm in taking him to task for it.

the paper, in effect, reports that the Hindus all over the world are pissed that their bragging right to say "Nepal is the only Hindu country in the world" has been snatched. read carefully! implication: if the HIndus of of the world want to see Nepal as a " Hindu state" just to maintain their bragging right, then I'm afraid this is the stupidest/shallowest reason I've ever read or heard. It is hilarous.

blame the news source for insulting the intelligence of the Hindus the world over. the new source probably thinks that the Hindus of the world are nothing but morons. so that's the level of reporting we get from the Hindu mouth piece, the Hindu weekly.

What can we expect done when all we have are corrupt and visionless leaders on one side and highly motivitated and ruthless killers on the other side and they both join hands.. we are doomed.. and are embarking a combined journey to finish the nation..

Ramlakhan,

You should learn history before lecturing about history. The Malla and Licchavis were also mainly Hindus. How do you account for all the Hindu temples in Kathmandu that predate the Gorkha period?

Bista's book is discredited in many academic circles because it has a tendency to ignore a lot of facts to suit his thesis,

R.

you guys tell me--will the holidays for Dashain or Tihar curtailed because now Nepal already turned into Secular may have its effects on Hindu culture, festivals like Dashain, tihar, Shiva Ratri, Ram Nawomi, Chitra desai, Krishna janmasthami.etc. If not curtailed then there can be voices supporting the holiday on other religions' festivals such as lohasar, Christian Happy New year, easter day, christmas days,etc,etc, too.

I doubt there are chances of confrontation between Hindus and nonhindus on above if not soon, later may be.

I am just curious to know about it, will anyone clear my mind on above?

bineet, nepalnews is crap and bias and you just want to read what you want to hear just like all the people crying like immature fools to have hindu state. if you are worried that violence may happen do this move, then would suggest you get together with your fellow people of nepal to stop this from happening or discouraging it. you have a brain then use for the betterment of people of nepal!!! just don't say he said or she said, fact can be fictionalize and there are alot of this happening!!!

shampoo... what do you mean were voices supporting the holiday on other religions' festivals such as losar, Christian Happy New year, easter day, christmas days, etc... before when nepal was a hindu kingdom???!!! just look at the holidays in nepal's calender and you are worried that the hindu festivals will be curtained, how selfish can you be???!!!!

secular nepal is not about weather the mojority are hindus or people of nepal did not get to vote for it!!! it is not weather in the future there "will be more convert to" christain, muslim, buddhist, etc.. from hindu!! it is about realizing and respecting the past, the present and the future of people of nepal whom are non hindus and just like hindus of nepal facing the sun daily... to survive as a dignified human being.

Hey Seveleaves
I never said hinduism flourished during shah dynasty. Well the impact of hinduism started well before malla and lichhavis .Even the kiratis called their god as kirateswor mahadev.

But the hinduism flourised in the valley and infact all over the principalities of today's Nepal .. when hindus of northern india started to migrate twds nepal...i.e well before shah's dynasty

Till now, despite of the majority being hindu, no religious fundamentalist groups could rise in nepal like in india. but now they r going to be strong. n what led to this? if they had just curtailed the king's powers, and had done nothing about the religion at this point of time, would this have happened?

The name "Hindu" was given by the British for the people that lived across the Indus river. Modern day "Hinduism" has been around for very very long time. It is one of the oldest religion of the world. There was no Buddhism, Hinduism or Muslimism in the old days. There was only one "dharma" - sanatana dharma. Buddha also advocated for the same religion, Buddha did not say it is a new religion, he said that he preaches dharma that is "sanatana". The modern day "Hinduism" has been defined and limited after the Muslim invasion more so after the British invasion.

People should get the facts straight before hammering on the religion.

there was not much religious violence under Saddam Hussein. at least we didn't hear about the Sunnis and Shiites fighting it out. Now that Saddam Hussein is gone, people are exploiting religious sentiments. sectarian violence is on the rise in Iraq. Why not reinstate Saddam Hussein to bring peace to Iraq?

Yeah why not bring back "Hindu Nepal" to avert the rise of future religious violence in Nepal?

What kind of fuzzy logic is this? And this is the logic being espoused by the many supporters of "Hindu State" on this sajha thread!

Secularism per se doesn't create violence; Hindu fundamentalism does, but Hindu fundamentalists are eager to blame it all on secularism. Secularism's being made a punching bag here. Their argument that "Hindu state" will avert religious violence is fallacious. Hell, it sure as hell was not able to avert Mr. Narayan Pokharel's murder allegedly by Hindu fundamentalists.

Secularism doesn't pose any threats to Hinduism. It is not going to uproot Hinduism. Well, it will certainly put Hinduism on an equal footing with other religions in the eye of law and the state. And this is good news. But Hindu fundamentalists don't want this, which goes onto show that they are really religious bigots and supremacists in disguise!

The problem with the many Hindu fundamentalists is that even as they argue that under Hindu Nepal, there had been religiuos harmony (which is, of course, all hogwash) they are keen to bash Christian missionaries. Just read about their Christian bashing in other threads of Sajha. These guys are hypocrites - while championing "Hindu state" as fostering religiuos harmony, they are increasingly being hostile toward Christian missionaries.

There is no doubt that Nepali Hindus are playing right into the hands of the India-based Hindu fundamentalist orgs and parties (who think Nepal is their "pewa") and their stooges (eg Bharat Keshari Simha, Sachhit Shumsher Rana, and the palace wallahs).

Any wonder the protests in Birgunj were fomented by a few hardcore royalists (and Hindu fundamentalists from across the border) who have since been exposed by the local papers!!!

cut the crap karmapa u are comparing hindu with saddam hussein regime.U are just out of ur mind .. u r just hindu hater not for secularism.Thats it.

Advocating for secularism doesn't make one a Hindu hater. Any idiot knows that. Apparently you don't, Imi!

You will probably be the first to lick Thackary's boots if he were he to come to Nepal - your devotion to India-based Hindu fundamentalist orgs and their stooges in Nepal is becoming increasingly well known in Sajha.

Congratulations!

Under Saddam Hussein, there was religious harmony in Iraq too!
Most people in Sajha argue there was religiuos harmony under "Hindu Nepal".
Now that Saddam Hussein is out of power, Sunnis and Shiites are fighting it out.
Now that Nepal has gone secular, there will likely be religious violence in Nepal.

So let's make Nepal a "Hindu state" again to avert religious violence.
This is tantamount to arguing let's reinstate Saddam Hussein to power to create

Logically, the comparison is apt!
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My argument is that secularism doesn't beget religious violence. Hindu fundamentalists and the royalists such Bharat Kshari do.

hey why do we discuss on a topic that is posted on Blognepal? It is known that Blognepal is paid and managed by the money of Madam Sujata Koirala.

Karmapa , u are hindu hater but u r trying to act too smart ass.U got platform to bash hindus u are not hindu and u are trying to potray how much u care about hindus and benefit from it.So u can fool anybody but not me.UR logic that hindu and sadam comaprision is way out of ur mind .Inorder to prove u r point u r going to the maximum extent of idioitic reasoning .anybody here reading knows that.
This is just a concern.future will tell what is going to happen for now u stop bashing hindus.U have done enough u must be satisfed to forth all the anger towards hindus.U don't listen to what i say in other thread so i don't have to listen .U cannot convince me .As i can't .Stop dragging my name .OK!!!

Yeah isn't that how an argument of a deeply divided kind usually ends. "I hold on to my views. You hold onto yours. I don't have to listen to you. You don't have to listen to me." Coming from you, this sounds like the last resort of a person who is at his wits' end.

What I find most stupid is when people on Sajha argue that secularism is going to invite religious violence and that the government should reinstate "Hindu Nepal" to foster religious harmony. This is a myth, just like saying King is an incarnation of a Hindu god and the like. It is a throwback to a period when many of us were brainwashed into believing this crap during the Panchayat era. And people are still parroting this.

But more than rationale or logic or what not, what religion one was born into is gonna have more bearing on what position people will take on the Hindu state vs secular state issue. So I don't blame the Hindus in Sajha for arguing for "Hindu state".

Imi, don't take too seriously my comparison between saddam and hinduism. you know as well as i do the world doesn't run on logic - although it does once in a while show holes in peoples' received wisdom.

but surely pay attention to my contention that many of the people who are arguing for "Hindu Nepal" are playing right into the hands of the India-based Hindu fundamentalists organisations and their stooges in Nepal knowingly or unknowingly. Hinduisation of Nepal will only lead to Indianisation of Nepal, and strengthen the royalists. Besides, this trend may infect the country's distinctively Nepali kind of Hinduism with a more virulent /fundamentalistic strain imported from India.

Hindu fundamentalism of an Indian/royalist kind poses a bigger threat to the Hinduism of a Nepali kind than secularism.

My wit has not ended But you are turning deaf and Blind!!!

one more thing in lay man way.i have already put my reasoning so many times in other threads too. But here is my stubborness as u so yours:"I DON'T WANT TO COMPROMISE THE TRADITION ,VALUES AND NAMES ASSOCIATED WITH FOR MERE POLITICAL GAME OF FEW LEADERS ,WHEN THERE IS NOT GOING TO BE ACTUAL SOCIAL CHANGE AND THE INTENTION OF THE POLITICIANS ARE TO EXPLOIT THIS ISSUE" GOT IT!!!
your BS logic as you said is not going to convince me that secularism is good for nepal because it will uplift hindus and minorities.That doesn't work like that.Who we,hindu, posses threat from we well very know .An outsider do not need to act like messiah .Rejoice and celebrate the loss of Hindus.congratulations!!!